演讲MP3+双语文稿:被对方批评的时候，我们该怎么做？
听力课堂TED音频栏目主要包括TED演讲的音频MP3及中英双语文稿，供各位英语爱好者学习使用。本文主要内容为演讲MP3+双语文稿:被对方批评的时候，我们该怎么做？，希望你会喜欢！
【演讲者及介绍】Bob Langert
鲍勃·兰格特公司可持续发展专家，他是企业可持续发展的顾问、撰稿人和演讲者，他向我们展示了企业如何成功地驾驭和管理当今有争议的社会问题，如何成为更好的企业公民，如何使企业更强大、更相关、更盈利。
【演讲主题】与最严厉的批评者合作的商业案例
【中英文字幕】
翻译者Jiasi Hao 校对者 psjmz mz
00:14
Who remembers this infamous Styrofoamcontainer?
谁还记得“臭名远扬”的泡沫塑料餐盒？
00:18
(Applause)
（掌声）
00:21
Well, it sure changed me, it changed mycompany, and it started a revelatory journey about how adversaries can be yourbest allies. You know, back in the late '80s, this Big Mac clamshell was thesymbol of a garbage crisis. People were really angry. For example, thousands ofstudents, young students around the globe were sending letters, blamingMcDonald's, because we were using millions of these at that time. Now, no oneat McDonald's knew anything about environmentally friendly packaging, includingme. The last 10 years, I was in charge of logistics and truck drivers. Then outof nowhere, my boss comes to me and says, "Hey, we want you to save thisclamshell for the company and lead the effort to reduce waste withinMcDonald's." I looked at him and I asked him, "What ispolystyrene?" But it all sounded intriguing to me because it brought meback to my roots.
这显然改变了我，改变了我公司，也开启了一场关于“竞争对手可以成为你最佳同盟”的启发性旅程。要知道，在80年代后期，这个巨无霸翻盖式餐盒是垃圾危机的象征。人们为此极其不满。比如，全球数千名年轻的学生们都寄出了谴责麦当劳的信件，因为那时我们正在使用上百万只这样的餐盒。麦当劳没有一个人熟悉环境友好的包装，包括我。在10年前，我主管物流和卡车司机。之后不知怎么的，老板找到了我，说：“嘿，我们想要你为公司节省翻盖餐盒方面的开支，带头减少麦当劳内部的浪费。”我看着他，问道：“泡沫塑料是什么？”但对我来说，这些听起来非常有趣，因为这把我带回了老本行。
01:26
You see, I grew up in the late '60s, early'70s, in a time of huge social upheaval in the United States. And I was reallyin tune with the protests, the sit-ins, the anti-Vietnam sentiment, and Ireally felt there was a need to question authority. But as I went intouniversity, I realized that I'm not going to make a living doing this. And thatwhole movement had subsided, and my activist spirit went dormant. And I neededto make a living, so I got involved in the business world. So, now thesestudents against pollution, who were sending those protest letters toMcDonald's, they reminded me of myself 20 years ago. They're questioningauthority. But now, I'm the man.
我在60年代末70年代初，美国社会极为动荡的时期下长大。我与抗议、静坐、反越战情绪步调一致，真的觉得有必要质疑权威。但是当我进入了大学，我意识到我将不会以此为生；再加上整个反抗运动的逐渐消退，我的活动家精神随之蛰伏。我还要生存，所以我进入了商业世界。现在那些学生反对污染，给麦当劳寄出了无数抗议信，他们使我想起了20年前的自己。他们正在质疑权威。但现在，我成了那个权威人士。
02:15
(Laughter)
（笑声）
02:17
I'm the corporate suit. I'm the onerepresenting authority. And this new thing was emerging called corporate socialresponsibility, later corporate sustainability, and now I had a chance to makea difference. So the beginning of this journey started when McDonald's agreedto a partnership with the Environmental Defense Fund. They were an NGO that wasfounded with the principle of "sue the bastards." So I'm thinking,what are they thinking about me and my team?
我是公司的门面，我是那个代表权威的人。有个新事物正在浮现，叫做企业社会责任，即后来的企业可持续性。现在，我手握一个改变的机会。这段旅程始于麦当劳同意与美国环保协会（EDF）形成合作伙伴关系。它们是非政府组织，以“告那些混蛋”为原则成立的组织。所以我在思考：他们怎么想我和我的团队？
02:53
When I first met Richard Denison, he's thesenior scientist for EDF, I was very apprehensive. I thought he's atree-hugger, and I'm thinking he thinks all I care about is the money. So wewanted the EDF team to give us real-world solutions. So we did the logicalthing. We had them flip burgers in our restaurants. So you have to imagineRichard, who, by the way, is a PhD in physics, and there he is, he's trying todress a quarter-pounder, and you're supposed to have two squirts of ketchup,one mustard, three pickles and an onion, go on to the next one, you've got tobe so fast. And you know what? He couldn't get it right all day long. And hewas frustrated. And I was so impressed, because he was trying to understand ourbusiness.
当我第一次见到EDF的高级科学家理查德·丹尼森时，我非常担忧，因为我以为他是环保极端人士，他会觉得我只在意钱。所以我们想要让 EDF 团队给我们一个实际解决方案。于是我们做了最符合逻辑的事：让他们在我们餐厅里翻汉堡包。你要想象理查德，一个物理学博士，在那里尝试给 1/4 磅的肉饼调味，而且应该是 2 股番茄酱，1 股芥末，3 片腌黄瓜和 1 片洋葱，然后继续下一个，你动作一定要很快。你猜怎么着？这种节奏他根本维持不了一整天。他很受挫，而我非常敬佩他，因为他在尝试着理解我们的生意。
03:44
Now, the EDF team, they thought reusableswere the holy grail for our business. Me and my team thought, reusables? Toomuch space, they'd make a mess, they would slow us down. But we didn't rejectthe idea. We went to the restaurant they chose outside DC, we went to the backroom. The dishwasher wasn't working properly, it's spitting out dirty dishes.The kitchen area is dirty and grimy. And compared to their experience atMcDonald's that's clean and organized, they could see the stark difference. Wealso sat in a restaurant at McDonald's, all day long, and watched the customerseating in. Their behavior. Ends up that many customers left with the food, theyleft with the beverage. And EDF came to their own conclusion that reusableswouldn't work for us.
之后 EDF 团队认为可回收材料是我们成功的关键。而我和我的团队们并不看好可回收材料——太占地方了，一定会狼藉一片，它们会拖慢我们的速度。但我们没有拒绝这个想法。我们去了他们选的一家华盛顿郊外的餐厅，去了后厨。洗碗机坏了，脏碟子到处都是。厨房区域满是灰尘和污渍。相比他们在麦当劳干净且有组织的体验，他们能看到彻底的不同。我们也整天坐在麦当劳里，观察堂食顾客的行为。我们发现，许多客人都把餐食带走，留下了饮料。于是 EDF 团队得出了他们自己的结论，即可回收材料不适合我们。
04:34
But they did have a lot of ideas that didwork. And we never would have thought of them by ourselves, without the EDFteam. My favorite was switching from the white carry-out bag to the brown bag.We had been using the white bag. It's virgin material, it's made from chlorinebleaching chemicals, and they said, use an unbleached bag, no chemicals. It'smade from recycled content, mostly recycled shipping corrugated boxes. Ends upthat the bag is stronger, the fiber is stronger, it didn't cost us more money.It was win-win.
但他们也有很多有用的想法。没有 EDF 团队，我们自己肯定不会想到这些。我最喜欢的就是从白色外卖纸袋改成棕色纸袋。我们很长一段时间都在用白色纸袋。这是纯净原材料，由氯漂白化学物质制成，之后他们说，“用未经漂白的袋子，里面没有有害化学物质。”这是由可回收物品制成的，主要原材料是打包用的瓦楞纸箱。最终我们发现这样的纸袋更加牢固，纤维更具韧性，也不会增加成本，是个双赢的替代方案。
05:25
Another idea they had was that we couldreduce our napkin by one inch. And make it from recycled office paper. I'mthinking, one inch, no big deal. We did it, it reduced waste by three millionpounds a year. Sixteen thousand trees saved.
他们的另一个想法就是我们可以把纸巾缩小一英寸，使用可回收的办公室用纸制作。我想，一英寸，不是啥大事儿。我们于是实行了这个想法，每年减少了 300 万磅废弃物，保护了 1.6 万树木。
05:44
(Applause)
（掌声）
05:49
What was really cool is we changed thatbright white napkin, because the recycled content became gray and speckled. Andwe made that look, you know, in tune, in vogue with customers. So, I came toreally enjoy the time working with the EDF team. We had many dinners,late-night discussions, we went to a ball game together. We became friends.
真正酷炫的是我们替换了原本的亮白纸巾。因为可回收材料制成的纸巾颜色较灰且有斑点，我们也把纸巾的造型改得符合大众期待和审美。因此，我开始真正地享受和 EDF 团队一起工作的时光。我们多次共进晚餐，开展了不少深夜讨论，也一起去打球。我们变成了朋友。
06:17
And that's when I learned a life lesson.That these NGO crusaders, they're really no different than me. They care, theyhave passion, we're just not different. So, we had a six-month partnership thatended up producing a 42-point waste reduction action plan. To reduce, reuse,recycle. We measured it during the decade of the '90s, and over 10 years wereduced 300 million pounds of waste. Now, if you're wondering about thatpolystyrene clamshell, yeah, we ditched it. And luckily, I still had a job.
也就在这时，我学会了一个人生教训。那些非政府组织中的战士们，和我真的没什么不一样。他们有责任感，他们拥有热情，我们没什么不同。我们六个月的合作共同达成了了一份包含 42 项内容的减废行动计划。减少废物、重新利用、循环使用。从 90 年代开始，我们测量了一下，10 年多的时间，我们总共减少了3 亿磅废物。现在如果你在回想那个泡沫塑料翻盖餐盒，没错，我们已经抛弃它了。幸运的是，我的工作没丢。
06:55
And this partnership was so successful thatwe went on to recycle the idea to work with critics. Collaborate with them onsolutions that could work for society and for business. But could this idea ofcollaborating work with the most contrarian folks? And on issues that are, youknow, not within our direct control. Like animal rights.
而且这个合作关系是如此成功，我们决定继续贯彻一个观点：与批判者协作。与他们合作共寻解决方案，以同时满足社会和企业需求。但这一个协作的想法对那些最逆势的人行得通吗？尤其是那些不在我们直接控制范围内的问题。例如动物权利。
07:24
Now, animal rights, obviously they don'twant animals used for meat. McDonald's, probably the biggest purchaser of meatin the food service industry. So there's a natural conflict there. But Ithought it would be best to go visit and learn from the most vociferous andvigilant critics we had at that time, which were Henry Spira, head of AnimalRights International, and Peter Singer, who wrote the book "AnimalLiberation," which is considered the modern treatise about animal rights.You know, I read Peter's book to prepare, I tried to get into his mindset, andI have to admit, it was tough, I'm not becoming a vegan, my company wasn'tgoing that way. But I really thought we could learn a lot.
关于动物权利，显然他们不想宰割动物以作肉用。麦当劳，可能是食品服务业中最大的肉类采购商。所以这里存在一个天然的矛盾。但我想如果能去拜访那些活跃且警觉的批判家们，并向他们学习，那就再好不过了。例如亨利·史匹拉，国际动物权利组织的负责人，还有彼得·辛格，他写了《动物解放》一书，被认为是关于动物权利的当代专著。为了做功课，我读了彼得的书，尽可能去理解他的思维模式，我必须承认，这很难，我也没有转变为纯素食者，我公司也没往那个方向发展。但是我确实认为从中可以学到很多。
08:08
And so I set up a breakfast meeting in NewYork City. And I remember sitting down, getting ready, and I decided I'm not goingto order my favorite, which is you know, bacon and sausage and eggs.
因此我在纽约安排了一个早餐会议。我记得当时坐了下来，做好准备，决定不点自己最爱的食物，就那种，培根、香肠和鸡蛋。
08:18
(Laughter)
（笑声）
08:20
And I'm just going to stick to thepastries. But I have to admit, I was waiting for the adversarial discussion tohappen. And it never did. Henry and Peter were just gracious, they were caring,they were smart, they asked good questions. I told them about how working onanimal welfare is very tough for McDonald's because our direct suppliers, they onlymake meat patties. The animals are three or four steps removed from ourinfluence. And they were very empathetic. And while we were so directly opposedin terms of the missions of our organizations, I felt that I had learned a lot.
我打算盯着面包糕点吃。但是我得承认，我原本等待着一次针锋相对的讨论，但出乎我意料的是，亨利和彼得表现得很亲切，他们体贴、聪慧，善于提问。我和他们说到，对麦当劳来说，在动物福利上下功夫很难。因为我们直接的供应商只生产肉饼。与动物相关的，在我们供应链上游的 3-4 个环节。之后他们非常感同身受。尽管考虑到各自的组织使命，我们本应针锋相对，但我觉得我学到了很多。
08:58
And best of all, they gave me a terrificrecommendation. And that is, they said, "You should work with Dr. TempleGrandin." Now, I didn't know her at the time. But I tell you, she's themost renowned expert, then and now, on animal behavior. And she knows howanimals move and how they should react in facilities. So I end up meeting her, andshe's the very best type of critic, in a sense that she just loves the animals,wants to protect them, but she also understands the reality of the meatbusiness. And I'll always remember, I had never been to a slaughterhouse in mylife, and so I go with her for my first trip. I didn't know what to expect. Andwe find that the animal handlers have electric prods in their hands, and arebasically zapping almost every animal in the facility. We're both appalled,she's jumping up and down, you'd have to know her, she's saying, "Thiscan't be, this isn't right, we could use flags, we could use plastic bags, wecould redesign the corrals for natural behavior."
最好的是，他们给了我一个绝妙的建议。他们说，“你应该和天宝·葛兰汀博士合作。”当时我并不知道她。但我要告诉你们，她一直以来，在动物行为学方面是最有声誉的专家。她知道动物的运动方式以及在设施中应有的反应。所以我后来和她见了面，发现她是最好的那种批判家，从某种意义上说她只是爱动物，想要保护它们，但是她也理解肉类行业的现实。而且我也永远都会记得，我第一次和她一起去屠宰场，而我此生还尚未见过屠宰场。我无法想象自己将会看到什么。我们发现畜管员手中拿着电棒，击杀着眼前近乎每一个动物。我俩都感到非常震惊，她急得直跳脚，你们一定要认识一下她，她说：“这不行，不能这么做。我们可以使用旗子，我们可以利用塑料袋，也可以根据动物的自然行为重新设计围栏。”
10:04
Well I set up Temple with our suppliers toset up standards and guidelines. And ways to measure her ideas of implementinganimal welfare. We did this for the next two to five years. And it all gotintegrated, it all got enforced. By the way, two of McDonald's suppliers lostbusiness because they didn't meet our standards. And best of all, all thesestandards ended up scaling to the entire industry. And no more zapping of thoseanimals.
总之，我把天宝和我们的供应商们聚集到一起，来制定标准和指南，以及能够衡量她实行动物福利想法的方法。我们在接下来的的 2-5 年一直在做这件事。所有的努力都得以被整合、被实行。顺便提一句，有两个麦当劳的供应商因为无法满足我们的标准，丢了生意。功夫不负有心人，所有这些标准最终变成了整个行业标准。用电棒击杀那些动物的行为早已不复存在。
10:33
Now, what about issues that we're blamedfor elsewhere? Like deforestation. You know, on that issue, I always thought,policy makers and government, that's their role. Never thought it would end upin my lap. But I remember in early April 2006, I opened up my Blackberry, andI'm reading about Greenpeace campaigners showing up in the UK by the dozens,dressed as chickens, having breakfast at McDonald's and chaining themselves tothe chairs and tables. So they got a lot of attention, including mine. And Iwas wondering if the report that they had just released, it was called"Eating Up the Amazon." And by the way, soy is a key ingredient forchicken feed, and that's the connection to McDonald's.
那我们被问责的其他问题呢？例如森林砍伐。在这个问题上，我一直想，这是政策制定者和政府的事儿。我从来没想过会成我的顾虑。但我记得在 2006 年 4 月初，我打开自己的黑莓手机，读到绿色和平组织（Greenpeace）的几十个活动者出现在英国，装扮成鸡，在麦当劳享用早餐，并把他们自己拴在桌椅上。他们获得了很多关注，包括我的。我在想是不是他们的报告刚被发行，报告名为《耗空亚马逊》（‘Eating Up the Amazon’）。顺便介绍一下，大豆是鸡饲料的关键材料，这就是它和麦当劳的联系。
11:23
So I called my trusted friends at the WorldWildlife Fund, I called Conservation International, and I soon learned that theGreenpeace report was accurate. So I gathered internal support, and I'll alwaysremember, next day, after that campaign, I called them up, and I said, "Weagree with you." And I said, "How about working together?" Sothree days later, miraculously, four people from McDonald's, four people fromGreenpeace, we're meeting in the London Heathrow airport. And I have to say,the first hour was shaky, it wasn't a whole lot of trust in the room. But itseemed like everything came together, because each of us wanted to save theAmazon. And during our discussions, you couldn't really tell, I don't think,who was from Greenpeace and who was from McDonald's.
于是我打电话给我在世界野生动物基金（WWF）的一些可靠的朋友，打电话给保护国际（CI），很快我就意识到，绿色和平组织的报告数据是准确的。所以我聚集起公司内部支持，我永远都会记得，在那个运动的第二天，我打电话给他们，并且说，“我们同意你们的观点。”我又说，“要不我们合作？”于是三天后，4 个麦当劳的人和 4 个绿色和平的人奇迹般地在伦敦希思罗机场进行了会面。我必须说，第一个小时的气氛不太稳定，房间里没几分信任存在。但似乎情况正在好转，因为我们每一个人都想挽救亚马逊。在我们的讨论中，你无法完全区分谁来自绿色和平，谁来自麦当劳，我也看不出。
12:18
So one of the best things we did is wetraveled with them for nine days on a trip through the Amazon, on theGreenpeace airplane, on the Greenpeace boat. And I'll always remember, imaginetraveling hundreds of miles west of Manaus, the capital city of the Amazon. Andit's so pristine beauty, there's no man-made structures, there's no roads, notone wire, not one house. You would travel east of Manaus and you would see theblatant rainforest destruction. So this very unlikely collaboration producedoutstanding results. By working together, we recruited over a dozen otherretailers and suppliers for the same cause. And by the way, within threemonths, a moratorium on these clear-cutting practices was announced by theindustry. And Greenpeace themselves declared it as a spectacular drop indeforestation and it's been in effect ever since.
所以我们做的最棒的一件事，就是跟他们一起参与了亚马逊九日游——乘坐绿色和平的飞机，搭乘绿色和平的船。我永远会记得，想象在亚马逊首都马瑙斯以西数十里处穿梭时看到的那种原始的美丽。没有人造建筑，没有马路，没有一根电线，没有一座房子。而当你前往马瑙斯以东，就会看到明目张胆的雨林破坏。所以这个非常不可能的合作产出了优秀成果。通过合作，出于同样的原因，我们又动员了其他几十个零售商和供应商。在三个月内，业界就颁布了一条禁止滥伐条例。绿色和平组织自己宣称这一条例使得森林砍伐骤减，并且始终能有效遏制森林砍伐。
13:21
Now, you think these types ofcollaborations that I've described would be commonplace today. But they're not.When organizations are battered, the common response is to deny and push back,put out some sort of lame statement and no progress is made at all. I say thealternative is really powerful. I mean, it's not going to fix every problem,and there's more to do for sure, but this idea of working with critics andtrying to do more good for society that actually is good for business, believeme, it's possible. But it starts with the idea that you need to assume the bestintentions of your critics. Just like you have the best intentions. And thensecondly, you need to look past a lot of these tactics. I admit, I did not likea lot of the tactics used on my company. But instead, focus on what the truthis, what's the right thing to do, what's the science, what's the facts. Andlastly, you know, I would say, give the critics the keys. Show them the backroom. Bring them there, don't hide the details, because if you want allies andsupport, you need to be open and transparent.
现在，你会觉得我刚才讲的那些合作类型在今天非常普遍。但其实不是。当组织受到抨击时，普遍的回应是否认、反抗、发表一些毫无说服力的声明, 事情毫无改观。我想说这个替代方法非常强大。我不是说要去解决每一个问题，因为必然总有更多问题需要解决，但是与批判者合作并且尝试做更多好事来回馈社会的想法对公司确实也是有利的。相信我，这是可能的。但这始于一个假设：假设那些批判者是出于一个良好的初衷。就像你有一个很好的初衷。之后，你需要大量回顾这些策略。我承认，很多在我公司实行的策略我不怎么喜欢。但相反，要关注什么是真相，什么是应该做的正确的事？什么是科学？什么是事实？最后，我会说，把钥匙交给批判者们，让他们去后台看看。把他们带过去，不要隐藏细节，因为如果你想要同盟与支持，你需要坦诚和透明。
14:38
Now, whether you're a corporate suit,whether you're a tree-hugger, I say the next time you're criticized, reach out,listen, learn. You'll become better, your organization will become better, andyou might make some good friends along the way.
不论你是企业门面，还是环保极端人士，下次你被批判的时候，试着联系，倾听，学习。你会变得更好，你的组织会变得更好，沿途还可能交些好友。
14:55
Thank you.
谢谢。
14:57
(Applause)
（掌声）
